perception

Welcome to NerdWallet’s Smart Money podcast, where we answer your real-world money questions. In this episode:

Understand how first-gen Americans can achieve financial success with tips for balancing cultural obligations and wealth-building strategies.

How can first-generation Americans grow their wealth and protect their money? How can you set financial boundaries with family and friends while staying committed to your long-term financial goals? Hosts Sean Pyles and Kim Palmer discuss the unique financial challenges faced by first-generation Americans and immigrant families to help you understand strategies for achieving financial independence. They begin with a discussion of tips and tricks on managing dual financial pressures of supporting oneself and one’s parents and breaking cycles of poverty through self-compassion and financial education.

Jannese Torres, host of the personal finance podcast Yo Quiero Dinero, joins Kim to discuss the importance of building a strong financial support network tailored to individual needs. They discuss strategies for identifying trustworthy financial advisors, setting and maintaining financial boundaries with family and friends, and gracefully declining costly invitations in favor of ensuring long-term financial success. This episode is essential listening for anyone navigating cultural and familial obligations while striving for financial independence.

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This transcript was generated from podcast audio by an AI tool.

Sean Pyles:

Welcome to NerdWallet’s Smart Money podcast. I’m Sean Pyles.

Kim Palmer:

And I’m Kim Palmer.

Sean Pyles:

On Smart Money, we are all about answering your money questions, and today we’re tackling an important one: How can first-generation Americans grow their wealth and protect their money? Kim, in her role as the host of our regular book club series, is here to guide the conversation. So Kim, who are you talking with?

Kim Palmer:

I am speaking with Jannese Torres, author of the new book, Financially Lit!: The Modern Latina’s Guide to Level Up Your Dinero & Become Financially Poderosa. She is also the host of the personal finance podcast Yo Quiero Dinero, and we are joined by my fellow Nerd Melissa Lambarena, a writer on the credit cards team, who also serves as an English and Spanish language spokesperson here at NerdWallet.

Sean Pyles:

Sounds great. Well, I will let you all take things from here.

Kim Palmer:

Great. Thank you. Jannese, thank you so much for joining Melissa and me today.

Jannese Torres:

Thank you so much for having me. Excited to be here.

Kim Palmer:

Let’s start with what’s unique about money for first-generation Americans and immigrant families. You write about how money is often not talked about, for example. Can you share some of those financial challenges that first-generation Americans often face?

Jannese Torres:

Absolutely. So I think at its core, it can start with something as simple as the language barrier. For many first-gen kids, we could be the family translators, oftentimes in financial situations. And so it’s not uncommon for us to take on the responsibility of helping our parents file their tax returns, navigate balancing a checkbook, or any number of other financial tasks that, for folks who can speak English, it’s just so much easier to do that.

So that’s one thing. But then I think there’s a lot of, maybe I would call them cultural nuances, that make the financial industry and first-gen communities kind of be at odds in a way. And I think some of that comes from the fact that there is this lack of culturally competent education and information oftentimes. It’s really even really hard to find alternate language content from a banking institution or a financial institution.

And also, there’s a lot of trauma associated with finances, especially if your parents have come from another country where maybe the economic situation is not as stable. There’s a big mistrust of financial institutions. So a lot of those things can compound in a way that make us very fearful of money and also the institutions that control it.

Melissa Lambarena:

I can definitely relate to that as a first-generation American, having to help my parents with a lot of these, figuring out different documents and a lot of these financial questions. Another thing that impacts us is that we might have to save for our own future, but also support parents who lack retirement savings in the present. And this is something that you talk about in your book. What do you see or want for people who find themselves in this situation?

Jannese Torres:

Well, I think first off, it requires a lot of self-compassion because what I find is there can be a lot of resentment and frustration amongst first-gen kids who feel like, well, why didn’t mom and dad do better? And it’s like we have to have the context and understand that they couldn’t do what they didn’t know. It’s not like financial literacy information is pervasive regardless of where you’re from, but especially when you’re from an immigrant community.

And so I like to refer to the oxygen mask analogy, for especially first-gen kids, because at the end of the day, the foundation that you are building as a wealth builder is only going to be as stable as you make it. If you overextend yourself or just find yourself continuously helping everybody else, but at the expense of your own future self, then it’s just going to perpetuate this cycle of poverty and struggle and feeling like we keep working towards a goal that we never actually achieve.

So I do recommend that folks prioritize their own financial stability. But then also, if you know that you’re going to be in a position to have to financially take care of someone, start having those conversations early and often so that you can start to understand the scope of what that’s going to look like and then make a plan accordingly.

Kim Palmer:

In the foreword of your book, it notes that a lot of personal finance publishers really have a blind spot, and they’re mainly writing for wealthy, white older readers. When did you realize the need for a podcast and a book like yours, and what kind of questions do you get from listeners that they might not hear anywhere else?

Jannese Torres:

I’ve been consuming personal finance content since 2016. And after about three years, I realized that the voices just didn’t 100% resonate with my lived experience as a first-gen Latina. And so that’s when I decided to stick my foot in and decide to launch the podcast, which inevitably led to my opportunity to write this book.

It’s definitely been inspired by the numerous conversations that I’ve had on the podcast where folks feel a lot of imposter syndrome for wanting wealth, a lot of fear because there is that lack of knowledge and a lack of trustworthy resources that we can go to, to learn more about this information. And I have found that it really moves the needle when people can hear stories from folks that they can resonate with.

And that’s why I think it’s so important to have that cultural context when we’re talking about money. Because for example, I think a lot of the mainstream personal finance content is very individualistic-based, especially here in America. Whereas for a lot of communities of color, it’s not unheard of to have multigenerational households where people are contributing collectively towards financial goals.

And just the idea of the bootstraps narrative and picking yourself up and working hard, but just for yourself, it doesn’t really align with how we operate most often in our communities.

Melissa Lambarena:

And financial trauma is something that you approach in your book that is often not seen across many personal finance books. Is this something that is left out of other personal finance books, and how can people get to the root of their financial trauma to make progress on their financial goals?

Jannese Torres:

I mean, I think the whole conversation around mental health and money is something that it needs to be more prevalent. Because I’ve found time and time again that it doesn’t matter if you tell somebody what they should be doing, whether it’s budgeting, saving, or investing — if they have mental health issues and financial trauma, that is going to prevent them from taking those steps. And so getting to the root of your money beliefs is a critical part of this whole journey.

For me, it was really important to include that information in the book. One of the things that I do is I walk readers through understanding where those narratives that we have internalized come from. If you have a perception that wealth is somehow intrinsically bad or immoral, did you grow up in a household where maybe that was the messaging from a religious aspect? Or did you see your parents fighting over money, and so it makes you afraid to talk about it with your partner? All of those things are subconsciously impacting how we operate with money, and I think it’s important for folks to have that context because oftentimes there’s just this shame and guilt that we feel about us not being able to make progress. But you have to understand why you feel the way you do about money before you can start to change those narratives.

Kim Palmer:

I totally agree. I’m so glad that we’re having those conversations more now. I don’t know if you’ve noticed this too, but I do feel like in the personal finance space, people are willing to talk about the mental health side of things more. It seems like something that’s coming up more often.

Jannese Torres:

Absolutely. I think there is less of a stigma when it comes to just talking about mental health in general, but I think that has not necessarily been at the same pace depending on where you’re from. I think for especially communities of color, there still is a lot of stigma about first talking about mental health and then letting folks know that you might be working with a therapist.

So I think the more that we normalize these conversations, the less they’ll be taboo, and the more open that people can be. Because you often realize once you start talking to other folks, there’s a lot of people that are going through the same exact emotions, and it just helps you feel less alone when you know that there are safe spaces where you can talk about this.

Kim Palmer:

Yes, absolutely. You also write about the importance of making yourself more financially secure with multiple income streams. And I love your personal story with this, how your side hustle started with a blog. So I’d love if you can share how your own side hustle helped you after an unexpected job loss and why it’s so important to have those multiple income streams.

Jannese Torres:

So I consider myself an elder millennial. I graduated about six months before the Great Recession. And so even though I went to school and got a degree in order to “get the stable job,” I did not experience that as soon as I got into the workforce. I found a lot of folks having unexpected layoffs.

And seeing especially people who had dedicated 20, 30 years plus to a company and be walked out the door with nothing more than a thank you and a box to collect their things, I think that for me was a very jarring realization at a young age that maybe it’s just not so stable out here in the corporate world. I always had that in the back of my head that I did want to diversify my income.

And then when I got laid off in January of 2014, it was confirmation of all these feelings that I’d had about just not putting all your eggs in one basket when it comes to your financial stability. I had been dabbling with content creation with the blog in early 2013. And when I got laid off, I took a couple of months. Instead of rushing back to get another job, I decided to double down and really learn on how you could turn an online content-based blog into an actual business.

And so I started learning about things like affiliate marketing and brand partnerships and how do you put ads on your website. And so that led me down a rabbit hole of entrepreneurship, which led me into the personal finance space. It’s been a really interesting experience seeing how you can have the power to create your own income streams just with ideas that you come up with with your head.

I like to encourage folks to really take a look at their skill sets, whether those are personal or professional skills, and see how you can turn them into a side hustle. Because at the bare minimum, you’ll be able to make extra money to pay off debt or save and invest. Best-case scenario is you might be building your new career.

Kim Palmer:

For sure. And then, as you found, if your main job source or source of income disappears, you have that to fall back on.

Jannese Torres:

Absolutely. There’s just a sense of power that comes from knowing that nobody can mess with you financially, especially if you have different ways of making money.

Kim Palmer:

Yes, I love that.

Melissa Lambarena:

I think a lot of our listeners are going to be inspired by that story. It’s important to stay aware and just read up on what other people are doing out there. And on that note, some people might not want to quit their job if they enjoy what they do or they like having that security of a full-time job. In that situation, what are some options that people may have to create multiple income streams, and have you stumbled upon any success stories throughout your work?

Jannese Torres:

Well, I think that at the bare minimum, we should all be using some of our disposable income to invest. Because when it comes to making that sexy passive income that everybody wants to make, that’s the easiest way to do it. Creating an additional income stream through dividend investing and through capital gains, that’s number one. If you don’t have access to an investment account through your job, anybody who has earned income can open a traditional or a Roth IRA.

So just think about what those options are for you. It doesn’t have to be that you’re building a business. There’s folks who decide to purchase real estate, and that’s how they create a secondary income stream. There’s folks who decide not to buy physical real estate, but they can invest in REITs or real estate investment trusts and be getting paid monthly rental income just by being an investor.

There’s other ways to make money versus just starting a business. But I think it’s just, like I said before, not put all your eggs in a basket. And at the bare minimum, I think it’s really important, especially in this uncertain time that we’re living in, to think about bulking up your emergency funds just because it is taking longer for folks to find jobs if they do get laid off. And knowing that you don’t have to take the first offer and you have room to breathe and figure out what your next steps are, I think that’s something everybody should be thinking about.

Kim Palmer:

You also write about the importance of creating a support network for people when it comes to their money. Can you explain what exactly does that look like? How can we create that support network?

Jannese Torres:

Absolutely. So I did find myself at various points of my personal finance journey feeling unqualified to make decisions, whether it was thinking about am I ready to leave my job and take on entrepreneurship full time, or how do I start investing on behalf of my family, knowing that I want to be able to help them financially? And so in those scenarios, I needed a second opinion and I started working with a certified financial professional.

I’ve worked with an accountant now through my business. I have an attorney. So there’s different folks who are experts in their field who are going to be able to help you navigate moments where you just don’t feel like you have all the information that you need. And I think it’s important to know that you don’t have to figure all of this out alone, and oftentimes you probably shouldn’t.

Like in the case where I was thinking about creating an estate plan, I did not feel comfortable taking on some DIY template and hoping that that was going to pass the bar in the event that I needed to use it for legal purposes. And so in that instance, I decided to seek out an estate planning attorney to help me figure that out. So I think it’s just important for you to know there are people out here who can help answer these questions so that you don’t feel this overwhelming pressure to figure it all out yourself.

Kim Palmer:

For sure. One thing you write about, too, though is that it can be hard to know who you could trust, and you talk about the importance of boundaries and what to do when family members ask you for money. And today on social media, when there’s people who call themselves experts talking about all kinds of things, how do you decide who you can trust in this scenario when you’re trying to build your own support network like that?

Jannese Torres:

I think it’s important to trust, but verify. So not just taking all of your information from a single source. There’s so many different places to learn about personal finance that I like to diversify my education the same way that I like to diversify my income. Doing your due diligence, making sure that you are researching somebody just to understand what information is out there about them.

When we’re talking about financial professionals, there are certification boards and different places that you can look for, making sure that they are still in good standing. I like referrals too. There’s something about working with someone who has a direct relationship with someone that you know. That can be a good strategy. Also, going online and searching for reviews.

There’s no such thing as too much research when it comes to figuring out who you can trust. And I like to think that people naturally reveal themselves after a certain amount of time, so be on the lookout for that too.

Kim Palmer:

Yes. I like that phrase that you used about diversifying your education and your sources. That makes a lot of sense.

Melissa Lambarena:

It’s also important to gather support for your financial goals, and that’s something that you talk about in your book. Some family members or friends may not understand what we’re trying to do, and setting boundaries around money can help you fulfill those goals that you might have, whether it’s to save or get out of debt. What are some ways that you’ve had to navigate this and what advice can you share with our listeners?

Jannese Torres:

I think the first thing is to understand that it’s not going to be very productive to ask someone for directions to a place that they’ve never been. When I say that, I mean, if you were the first person to be investing in the stock market, it’s probably not going to be very productive to talk to your family about this if nobody’s doing it. And so just the idea that you can create your own community of support, I think it’s an important thing to consider.

Because most often we look to the people that we already know to validate what we’re trying to do and to understand, and it’s not necessarily their job. It’s your job to understand the mission that you’re on and then to rally the troops, if you will, create community, whether that’s in person or online. I have found an incredible community of entrepreneurs who support me from all over the world online.

And it’s the same thing with being a first-gen wealth builder. When you start talking about this stuff, you’ll naturally find the people who are aligned with where you are and where you’re trying to go. And so I think it’s just important that you don’t necessarily limit your scope for creating that community amongst the people that you already know. It might require you to be in new spaces and have conversations with new people.

Melissa Lambarena:

What about when it comes to setting boundaries around money? When family members say they want to go on vacation or those weddings come up or holidays, how do you navigate that in a culture that sometimes isn’t used to talking about money at times?

Jannese Torres:

Those scenarios are absolutely challenging. I don’t want to make it seem like it’s not going to be difficult to stand up to the people that you love and say, “You know what? I just can’t swing this. I’m working on other goals and this is just not at the top of my list.” You’re going to have to be okay with people not getting it. And unfortunately, sometimes that’s going to mean maybe offending somebody.

But at the end of the day, we have to develop a thick skin when it comes to staying true to what our values are and understanding that this short-term sacrifice is going to then allow you to potentially be in a position in the future where you can splurge, where you can actually be the one that’s treating your family to these awesome experiences because now you’ve put yourself in a financial position to be able to do so.

I think it’s just important to maintain that long-term perspective and to understand that not everybody’s going to get it, but it’s not necessarily for them to get.

Kim Palmer:

Yeah, and that’s really motivating too. I wanted to delve into some of your specific tips and why they matter. So I picked out a few to highlight. First, your practice your salary negotiation script idea. I love this one because it’s something my own dad also told me about. So tell us why that’s so important and why it can be helpful.

Jannese Torres:

Yeah. Well, at the end of the day, negotiation is an art form. It is a skillset that you have to hone in. You have to work it just like a muscle. And so I think oftentimes when folks even start thinking about negotiation, it’s usually in the context of a salary or a promotion. And that can feel very life or death for some people. It’s like, oh my god, if this doesn’t go right, what’s going to happen? And so I like to encourage folks to start with the basics.

Calling up your credit card company and seeing if you can negotiate a lower interest rate, or when your renewal term is coming up for a streaming service and they want to double your rate, give them a call and say, “You know what? I can’t do this. I’m only going to stay on if you guys can match the introductory rate that I already had.” You’d be surprised how often companies want to retain you as a customer and are willing to make those negotiations.

And so the more comfortable that you get with those small things, when there are bigger things at stake, whether that’s negotiating the price of a car or a house or your salary, you’re going to have more practice and you’re going to have more confidence because you’re going to have more of those wins under your belt.

Kim Palmer:

Yes, that is so true. The second one I wanted to highlight is applying the 50/30/20 budgeting rule. At NerdWallet, that’s also something that we talk about a lot. Can you explain why it works so well?

Jannese Torres:

Well, I think it’s a good baseline for a lot of people to understand where they should be with regards to their fixed and their variable expenses, as well as their savings goals. Now, the thing that makes it an eye-roll situation for a lot of people is depending on where you live, those percentages can be wildly different. If you live in a very high-cost-of-living area, it’s not uncommon for you to be spending 60, 70, maybe even 80% of your income on those fixed expenses.

And so I think it’s a good baseline for folks to set up their first budgets, but I don’t think that you should let it discourage you if you have to tweak those parameters. Because at the end of the day, budgeting is just like personal finance. It really is an individual-based journey, and you have to figure out the system that works best for you.

Kim Palmer:

And finally, you say create sinking funds, which I don’t think everyone is familiar with that term. So can you explain how sinking funds work?

Jannese Torres:

Sure. I love a good sinking fund, and I had no idea what they were until I started down the rabbit hole of personal finance. And essentially, you’re just creating buckets of money for specific purposes. I think most folks are familiar with an emergency fund, and an emergency fund is just a type of sinking fund that you’re saving specifically for emergencies. But I encourage people to think about all of those goals that you have, whether that’s buying a home or upgrading your car or taking a luxurious vacation.

We can create sinking funds for all of these different goals that we have, and that way your money is clearly earmarked for that purpose. It’s easier to see when you’re making progress towards those specific goals instead of having all of your savings in one pot and then hoping that you have allocated enough for all of the things that you want to do. There’s something very visual about being able to track your progress for those individual goals that makes it much easier for a lot of people to maintain that momentum versus just having a pot of money with no designated purpose.

Kim Palmer:

For sure. And also helps you stay organized, I think, and just make sure you’re on track.

Jannese Torres:

Absolutely.

Kim Palmer:

Well, thank you so much, Jannese. Do you have any closing thoughts to share with our listeners?

Jannese Torres:

Well, I like to always remind folks that personal finance and getting your money stuff together is a journey. It is a marathon. It is not a sprint. And so the best thing that you can do is just be a perpetual learner, a continuous student, and never be afraid to ask a question because this world is changing so often, so rapidly. So keep learning, keep growing, and keep applying what you learn.

Kim Palmer:

That is the perfect note to end on. Jannese Torres, thank you so much for joining us on Smart Money.

Jannese Torres:

Thanks so much.

Kim Palmer:

And that’s all we have for this episode. To share your thoughts on money, shoot us an email at [email protected].

Sean Pyles:

Visit nerdwallet.com/podcast for more info on this episode. And remember, you can follow the show on your favorite podcast app, including Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and iHeartRadio to automatically download new episodes.

Kim Palmer:

This episode was produced by Sean Pyles, Melissa Lambarena, and myself. Tess Vigeland helped with the editing. And a big thank you to NerdWallet’s editors for all their help.

Sean Pyles:

And here’s our brief disclaimer. We are not financial or investment advisors. This nerdy info is provided for general educational and entertainment purposes and may not apply to your specific circumstances.

Kim Palmer: